Well as most coming to this page know, the trinity doctrine is held to by most, "Christian", denominations. The common term and belief of the trinity, is that the Father, son, and Spirit, are three separate parts, or entities, of the only one "God". Adherents of this doctrine believe it to be an absolute must to believe to be saved. Interesting concept though, is that many of these same people believe, once saved always saved. Do they believe that each and every believer automatically believes this doctrine the instant they believe? It has to be taught, even dogmatically insisted upon, that, "well you can't understand it, you just have to believe it." By the way, when I first believed, I knew nothing of this doctrine. It was dogmatically taught later, in the churches and in bible college. No one had to work hard to convince me, I just blindly believed like I was told. After all, they were the teachers, what did I know as a new believer? After years of reading the Scriptures through several times in several different translations and many hours of study in the Hebrew and Greek, I have come out the other side looking at this dogma, and many others, in the light of truth. History will also show where this doctrine actually came from and how it is paganism mingled with the true belief. Yes, I am aware of the passages of Scripture referring to the trinity. I've even taught this doctrine to others, in the past. You don't know it any better than I do, so don't bother trying to show me how ignorant I am. Hopefully, you can approach this subject with a humble and teachable spirit. I'm not saying this to be critical of you as I don't even know you. I do know the spirit of man though. I don't write this to generate argument, but to show forth truth. Let's take a look at some Scripture verses and some questions. The following quotes are from the King James Version. Matthew 3:17 "And lo a voice from heaven, saying, This is my beloved son, in whom I am well pleased." Mark 1:11 "And there came a voice from heaven,saying, Thou art my beloved son, in whom I am well pleased." Luke 3:22b " and a voice came from heaven, which said, Thou art my beloved son; in thee I am well pleased." Here we have three distinct but parallel passages of Scripture of the same incident. Let us take a look at what happened there. The saviour was baptized, so we know that he was there physically in person. We also know that there was a voice coming down from heaven which spoke to those present and specifically to the son. So let me ask, are we saying that the saviour was practicing some kind of magic for display? That would be against the Scriptures, the law forbids magic. Was he practicing ventriloquism? I don't believe so, do you? Do we believe that when the voice came down from heaven that the Creator was talking to Himself? Of course not! We also need to consider the transfiguration found in; Matt.17:1- 5, Mark 9:2 - 7 and Luke 9:28 - 35. YAHUAHSHUA "Jesus" stood with them physically and at the same time, there appeared a cloud and out of the cloud came a voice saying,"This is my beloved son, hear ye him." This shows that there is a distinct difference between the Father and the son. Do we believe that the Creator of the Heavens and the earth was playing some kind of game? No! The Father gave testimony of the son. Just like if a Father gave authority over a work crew to his son. He would say this is my son, do what he says. Let's move on to another period of time in the life of "Jesus". Matthew 26:39 "And he went a little farther, and fell on his face, and prayed, saying, O my Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me: nevertheless not as I will, but as thou wilt." Mark 14:35,36 "And he went forward a little, and fell on the ground, and prayed that, if it were possible, the hour might pass from him. 36. And he said, Abba, Father, all things are possible unto thee; nevertheless not what I will, but what thou wilt." Here again we have two parallel passages describing the same incident. A couple of points here need to be looked at. We know that in this passage as well as many other places in the Scripture that the saviour, prayed. If he is the Creator, who was he talking to, Himself? We can also see clearly in these passages not only that he was talking to someone else other than himself but also that there were TWO distinct wills or desires mentioned. This requires that there were TWO distinct entities conversing with one another. Continuing on, we can go to the time he was put to death. Matthew 27:46 "And about the ninth hour " Jesus " cried with a loud voice, saying, E'li, E'li, la'ma sa-bach-tha-ni? that is to say, My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?" Mark 15:34 "And at the ninth hour "Jesus" cried with a loud voice, saying, E-lo'i, E-lo'i, la'ma sa-bach'tha-ni? which isa being interpreted, My God, My God, why hast thou forsaken me?" Actually, correctly interpreted, it would say, "My Mighty One, My Mighty One, why hast thou forsaken me?" In any case, it shows that our Messiah had a Mighty One. It was someone different than himself whom he looked up to for all things. Luke 23:46 "And when "Jesus " had cried with a loud voice, he said, Father, into thy hands I commend my spirit: and having said thus, he gave up the ghost." I hate to ask this question again as it sounds so redundant, but here goes. Isn't it obvious here, that there were two separate entities involved? The son was talking to the Father. They are obviously NOT the same being. They are one, as a father and son in business together, would be one in purpose. Taking this one step further, Acts 13:33b: "this day have I begotten you". This comes from Psalms 2:7 ,so it is not a stand alone verse. This goes to prove that the Messiah, who was in the lineage of David, had a point in time when the Creator of the heavens and the earth said, "this day have I begotten you." This is why the lineage Joseph is included in the Scriptures. He was in the lineage of David and had to be, to fulfill the promises given to David. Our Heavenly Father always fulfills His promises. If therefore, there is a day that he was begotten, then he is not the Creator but is His son. If you would click on the MYTHOLOGY LINK to the left, you can go to the info links on Mithraism and Zoroastrianism on that page. By doing so you can study these two pagan religions, and find out where this trinity doctrine came from and see that paganism has been directly imported into the true belief again. This mingling of paganism with the true belief and worship is diametrically opposed to the laws of our HEAVENLY FATHER. Just like the Yis-ra'el ites who made and worshiped the golden calf after they had been delivered out of slavery. Sure they intended to worship our Heavenly Father and bring esteem to Him through it. Isn't it clear, that, that was NOT acceptable to HIM? |
Come Out Of Her My People |
Rev. 18:4 |
The Trinity doctrine. What is it? Where does it come from? |
Well as most coming to this page know, the trinity doctrine is held to by most, "Christian", denominations. The common term and belief of the trinity, is that the Father, son, and Spirit, are three separate parts, or entities, of the only one "God". Adherents of this doctrine believe it to be an absolute must to believe to be saved. Interesting concept though, is that many of these same people believe, once saved always saved. Do they believe that each and every believer automatically believes this doctrine the instant they believe? It has to be taught, even dogmatically insisted upon, that, "well you can't understand it, you just have to believe it." By the way, when I first believed, I knew nothing of this doctrine. It was dogmatically taught later, in the churches and in bible college. No one had to work hard to convince me, I just blindly believed like I was told. After all, they were the teachers, what did I know as a new believer? After years of reading the Scriptures through several times in several different translations and many hours of study in the Hebrew and Greek, I have come out the other side looking at this dogma, and many others, in the light of truth. History will also show where this doctrine actually came from and how it is paganism mingled with the true belief. Yes, I am aware of the passages of Scripture referring to the trinity. I've even taught this doctrine to others, in the past. You don't know it any better than I do, so don't bother trying to show me how ignorant I am. Hopefully, you can approach this subject with a humble and teachable spirit. I'm not saying this to be critical of you as I don't even know you. I do know the spirit of man though. I don't write this to generate argument, but to show forth truth. Let's take a look at some Scripture verses and some questions. The following quotes are from the King James Version. Matthew 3:17 "And lo a voice from heaven, saying, This is my beloved son, in whom I am well pleased." Mark 1:11 "And there came a voice from heaven,saying, Thou art my beloved son, in whom I am well pleased." Luke 3:22b " and a voice came from heaven, which said, Thou art my beloved son; in thee I am well pleased." Here we have three distinct but parallel passages of Scripture of the same incident. Let us take a look at what happened there. The saviour was baptized, so we know that he was there physically in person. We also know that there was a voice coming down from heaven which spoke to those present and specifically to the son. So let me ask, are we saying that the saviour was practicing some kind of magic for display? That would be against the Scriptures, the law forbids magic. Was he practicing ventriloquism? I don't believe so, do you? Do we believe that when the voice came down from heaven that the Creator was talking to Himself? Of course not! We also need to consider the transfiguration found in; Matt.17:1- 5, Mark 9:2 - 7 and Luke 9:28 - 35. YAHUAHSHUA "Jesus" stood with them physically and at the same time, there appeared a cloud and out of the cloud came a voice saying,"This is my beloved son, hear ye him." This shows that there is a distinct difference between the Father and the son. Do we believe that the Creator of the Heavens and the earth was playing some kind of game? No! The Father gave testimony of the son. Just like if a Father gave authority over a work crew to his son. He would say this is my son, do what he says. Let's move on to another period of time in the life of "Jesus". Matthew 26:39 "And he went a little farther, and fell on his face, and prayed, saying, O my Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me: nevertheless not as I will, but as thou wilt." Mark 14:35,36 "And he went forward a little, and fell on the ground, and prayed that, if it were possible, the hour might pass from him. 36. And he said, Abba, Father, all things are possible unto thee; nevertheless not what I will, but what thou wilt." Here again we have two parallel passages describing the same incident. A couple of points here need to be looked at. We know that in this passage as well as many other places in the Scripture that the saviour, prayed. If he is the Creator, who was he talking to, Himself? We can also see clearly in these passages not only that he was talking to someone else other than himself but also that there were TWO distinct wills or desires mentioned. This requires that there were TWO distinct entities conversing with one another. Continuing on, we can go to the time he was put to death. Matthew 27:46 "And about the ninth hour " Jesus " cried with a loud voice, saying, E'li, E'li, la'ma sa-bach-tha-ni? that is to say, My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?" Mark 15:34 "And at the ninth hour "Jesus" cried with a loud voice, saying, E-lo'i, E-lo'i, la'ma sa-bach'tha-ni? which isa being interpreted, My God, My God, why hast thou forsaken me?" Actually, correctly interpreted, it would say, "My Mighty One, My Mighty One, why hast thou forsaken me?" In any case, it shows that our Messiah had a Mighty One. It was someone different than himself whom he looked up to for all things. Luke 23:46 "And when "Jesus " had cried with a loud voice, he said, Father, into thy hands I commend my spirit: and having said thus, he gave up the ghost." I hate to ask this question again as it sounds so redundant, but here goes. Isn't it obvious here, that there were two separate entities involved? The son was talking to the Father. They are obviously NOT the same being. They are one, as a father and son in business together, would be one in purpose. Taking this one step further, Acts 13:33b: "this day have I begotten you". This comes from Psalms 2:7 ,so it is not a stand alone verse. This goes to prove that the Messiah, who was in the lineage of David, had a point in time when the Creator of the heavens and the earth said, "this day have I begotten you." This is why the lineage Joseph is included in the Scriptures. He was in the lineage of David and had to be, to fulfill the promises given to David. Our Heavenly Father always fulfills His promises. If therefore, there is a day that he was begotten, then he is not the Creator but is His son. If you would click on the MYTHOLOGY LINK to the left, you can go to the info links on Mithraism and Zoroastrianism on that page. By doing so you can study these two pagan religions, and find out where this trinity doctrine came from and see that paganism has been directly imported into the true belief again. This mingling of paganism with the true belief and worship is diametrically opposed to the laws of our HEAVENLY FATHER. Just like the Yis-ra'el ites who made and worshiped the golden calf after they had been delivered out of slavery. Sure they intended to worship our Heavenly Father and bring esteem to Him through it. Isn't it clear, that, that was NOT acceptable to HIM? |
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This page was last updated on: 8/11/02
